After Empire

[poliphilo]

Martin Amis has made a TV programme about the English in which i gather (I haven't seen it) he repeats the old chestnut about us "having lost an empire and not yet gained a role." Who first said that? Some mid-century statesman? More to the point, is it still true?

I'm beginning to doubt it. Nobody under fifty remembers imperial Britain. And even I, who am now in my 60s, only witnessed the roar of the shingle as the tide went out. By the time I was a teenager we were already reinventing ourselves: pop music, fashion, TV, movies, theatre, satire- that's how we were going to rule the world from now on.

Also, all through this period, the Empire was coming home. First the West Indians, then the Ugandan Asians, then everybody else- bringing all sorts of interesting cultural stuff with them. A substantial proportion of the population now consists of the grandchildren of people who weren't imperial rulers but imperial subjects. That's got to change things about a bit, don't you think?

I look at England today and I see a country that strikes me as quite lively in its own way. As upbeat as any country ever is.  We're still pretty good at all the things we set out to be good at in the 60s. And we're now pretty good at food too- which no-one can ever have expected. And computing which had hardly been invented back then. And top-end science. Oh, and banking which perhaps we should shut up about. Boris Johnson called London "the capital of the world" the other day- and it didn't seem like a wholly ridiculous claim. A nation in decline? Only if you measure greatness in terms of gun boats and boots on parade grounds. A people yearning for a time when half the globe was pink? I'm not feeling it. I don't believe I've felt it for years.

Comments

[artkouros.livejournal.com]

And the food they bring is delicious.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I don't think it's possible to overstate the changes they've brought about in English culture. Food's just the start of it.

[wyrmwwd.livejournal.com]

The U.S. is a "nation in decline". England has a creative, vibrant culture, especially in the Arts and in media. Educated people in the U.S. go to BBC for their news and watch mostly British television and cinema. And, I think we still consume a lot of your music.

We are probably headed towards a civil war that is going to knock us out of "superpower" status. I periodically investigate how possible it is for me to move to England and avoid all of this madness.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I partly agree and partly don't. I think your superpower status has already gone. After all, for all your fire-power, you've lost every foreign war you've fought since Viet-Nam. But maybe the day of the superpower is over, anyway. I don't see any nation state rising up to dominate the world the way you and the Soviet Union did.

But culturally the USA still looks vibrant to me. You're still producing TV, music and movies the world is eager to consume- and while much of that output is rubbish a good deal of it isn't.

[wyrmwwd.livejournal.com]

Shhhh.... I'm American... you aren't supposed to tell me that we have already lost our super-power status. That is a U.S. national secret. :-)

Seriously, though, the ever-increasing polarization is becoming very problematic, and I do think we are headed for a Second Civil War.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I can see the country drifting apart, and individual States seceding from the Union and central government having to let them go- but I don't believe there'll be a war. The cost would be far too high.

[wyrmwwd.livejournal.com]

Could be. We will have to see how it pans out. I think the vast majority of Americans are highly emotionally invested in keeping the Union whole. We have all been indoctrinated in it since birth: "One nation, under God, indivisible...". I've been reading the Facebook posts of people on the Right. The reason that they are so tweaked out about gun control is that they want to be armed in order to defend themselves against the government. There have always been folks here that felt that way, but I don't think the numbers have ever been this high. Of course, they could never win. Hopefully they know that. And, they are scattered all over the country. It wouldn't be just the South seceding, it would be all of the so called "red states". That is not geographically dependable.

I never thought I would see the Soviet Union fall, and it did. I wonder what is going to happen here.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

Large countries are always at risk of falling apart. So, come to think of it, are small ones. Here in Britain, for instance, there's a real chance that Scotland may decide to go it alone.

[davesmusictank.livejournal.com]

I too doubt that. however, stranger things have happened.

[davesmusictank.livejournal.com]

There is alot of good drama coming from the USA , but we have produced some great ones too.

[davesmusictank.livejournal.com]

I do feel that we have had moments of being in the cultural and artistic highs, and that is where we are now, and being good at creative and artistic endeavors.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

Me too.

[steepholm.livejournal.com]

It's quite a long time since I heard Martin Amis say anything either interesting or sensible, let alone both.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I must confess I've never read him, but I've read about him and about the books and I've always come away feeling, "I don't want anything to do with this guy."