The USA Betrays Its Principles

[poliphilo]

The USA is behaving very badly in the case of Julian Assange. Some of those political loud-mouths who have been shouting for his head don't even seem to be aware that he's not actually an American citizen. No, a US court can't try an Australian citizen for treason. As for espionage, well,  maybe they can get that one to stick if they file off some awkward corners, but it's hardly in the spirit of the law- or of the First Amendment.

Freedom of the press, freedom of information- the US is all for these excellent things when it's the secrets of foreign governments that are being exposed.  I loved how the Russians were proposing Assange for the Nobel prize. Very cheeky of them. I didn't think they were capable of that kind of humour. 

If the USA were the sort of society it says it is, it would have gone,"OK, you got us there," and would have set about tightening up its internet security. 

It's not as if these were deadly secrets that have been released. If the information I'm going on is correct, the documents were so low-level that £3,000,000 persons within the USA's government and state bureaucracy had access to them. All they are- especially when released en masse like this- is embarrassing to those in authority.

President Obama has just announced that the War in Afghanistan is "on track"- even though we know from WikiLeaks that it's hardly that. Politicians lie by reflex- even when the evidence that contradicts them is in plain view. By carrying on in this business-as-usual way the President demonstrates just why we need the kind of investigative journalism that  WikiLeaks represents.

By the way, what a terrible disappointment Obama has been.

The USA has flirted with fascism all through its modern history. We rather thought- when Bush stepped down- that the affair had cooled off.  We were horribly mistaken. 

Comments

[ideealisme.livejournal.com]

I kinda feel sorry for Obama. The foaming Left thought he was Jesus Christ, and sure as eggs is eggs, they crucified him, the way the left does when one of their own gets any real power. (The left don't seem to know what to do with power, they prefer not having it.) I think he's immobilised by the way Congressional elections are so close together and how the House is organised. But an American person can probably chime in with a better perspective.

I'm underwhelmed by Assange, to be honest. The Wikileaks drama seems to be about one Lone White Male struggling against the system-which-is-really-Daddy-in-disguise and showing his Valour and Bravery. Seen the plot in a million westerns. Daddy, aka the US, should just take no notice of him and do the damage limitation. Though I doubt if the damage is as extensive as everyone seems to think.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

Obama came in with so much goodwill behind him- and has achieved so little. He has carried on with Bush's war in Afghanistan and hasn't yet shut down Guantanamo. It's the same old, same old with a supposedly liberal figurehead.

I don't care that much for Assange as a person. Most investigative journalists are pricks. I expect they need to be to do that job. But I think their work is absolutely vital if our democracies are to stay democratic.

[michaleen.livejournal.com]

I think you are correct about the "foaming Left", to an extent, save that a plurality of the left supported Hillary Clinton for president and only grudgingly leant that support to Obama after she lost in the primaries -- if indeed they supported him at all. The far Left never supported Obama, so far as I am aware. They are not called the "Beautiful Losers" for nothing.

I am profoundly disappointed, but unsure how much I am disappointed by Obama, personally. He made good on at least some of what we were promised and has indeed delivered significant change, just no where nearly as much change as was necessary. To be honest, though, with many in his own party, everyone in the Republican party, and all the media arrayed against him, I do not know how much more we could have expected from Obama's presidency.

The man is black, highly intelligent, mildly progressive and actually appears to believe in the democratic process. As such, Obama is a political fluke and had it not been for eight years of Republican misrule, plus the looming nightmare of Sarah Palin in the White House, plus the US and world economies being in free fall, at the time, the man could never have been elected president in the first place.

[veronica-milvus.livejournal.com]

Politicians and diplomats have been used to doing things in secrecy for a thousand years. Nothing I heard from the Wikileaks stuff was a surprise. All governments maintain control by secrecy. The internet is rather wrecking that concept and they are angry. The trouble is, it is now blatantly transparent that they are using sneaky covert measures (the Swedish condom debacle) to neutralise people they don't like, and we can see all of that happening too and they don't like it one bit, because they are looking scheming and pathetic. If the US had said to the UK government, please extradite Assange on grounds of espionage, would they have done it? I expect they would. There is no need for all this Mission Impossible crap.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

My fear is the UK government would do anything the USA asked of it- and require nothing in return. Such selflessness.

Oh look- they've noticed we exist. How lovely!

[veronica-milvus.livejournal.com]

Well, yes but, because of Wikileaks, the UK government knows that the US thinks we are not so speshul, ackshully, and that our soldiers couldn't run a bath, never mind Helmand. Maybe that will make them less likely to roll over like a puppy.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

That would be excellent.

I wonder if Cameron has the backbone to take a slightly less star-bedazzled line with the USA

[internet-sampo.livejournal.com]

A reporter for the NY Times said that US diplomats are doing in secret what the State Dept. has been telling us that their goals are. Also, he said, they seemed to be doing it well.

It's another non-issue to stir up people. Dumb people.

[internet-sampo.livejournal.com]

Oh

http://www.npr.org/2010/12/08/131884250/nyt-reporter-defends-publishing-wikileaks-cables

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

"It is the responsibility of American journalism, back to the founding of this country, to get out and try to grapple with the hardest issues of the day and to do it independently of the government."

That is very well said.

The US government would have looked better- and smarter- and more in control- if it had shrugged This whole thing off.

[internet-sampo.livejournal.com]

I agree. But Obama does have to appease the right wing-nuts.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

But perhaps not quite as much as he has chosen to do.

[steepholm.livejournal.com]

It doesn't seem to have been very effective anyway - they demonize him just as much as they ever did. He might as well have done what presumably wanted to do instead.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

Liberals are nice guys, they want to get everyone on side, they don't want to exclude people. It's a built-in weakness.

[kishenehn.livejournal.com]

I fully agree ... and as an American, I've lost political hope for the foreseeable future.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

There's always hope. It often appears quite unexpectedly.

[airstrip.livejournal.com]

Obama has actually done quite a lot, just that none of it is foreign affairs, so foreigners are naturally uninterested.

They can't try Assange for anything, he's committed no crimes under US law. The worst thing is that all this is distracting from the real revelation: the US is quite a bit better than its critics. Putin is an excellent example.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

True. I judge Obama- as we judge all US presidents- very largely on his foreign policy.

I pay the US the compliment of holding it to higher standards than China or Russia. When Chinese dissidents are imprisoned and Russian journalists assassinated it's no more than I expect.

[airstrip.livejournal.com]

And I wish people would stop, it distorts outcomes in this country and gets us into wars because the President must seek accolades through foreign adventures.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

Being a war-time leader is what gets one into the history books. Tony Blair knew that. He never passed up an opportunity to send in the troops.

[airstrip.livejournal.com]

TR, Taft, Hoover, FDR, Eisenhower, Kennedy. Johnson, Nixon, Carter, Reagan, Clinton.

All more famous for non-military endeavors. FDR even fought WWII but he is more famous for the New Deal.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

That's an American perspective. Over here we remember FDR primarily as a wartime president- because that's how he impinged on us. And Johnson is remembered for Vietnam. Nixon too- though he is also remembered for Watergate and China.

Taft is just a name to me. Hoover was famously corrupt and has a dam named after him. TR I remember for storming San Juan Hill and shooting bears. I know little about Eisenhower's accomplishments in the presidency- but quite a lot about the European campaign he commanded.

And what did Kennedy actually achieve? All I remember is the Bay of Pigs and The Cuban Missile Crisis- a military fiasco and an exercise in brinkmanship that averted war.

[michaleen.livejournal.com]

Obama has actually done quite a lot, just that none of it is foreign affairs, so foreigners are naturally uninterested.

Exactly so and this cannot be repeated often enough. I want to rage, but on the whole find Obama to be a poor target. I do not know what he could have done differently, short of following through on those FEMA death camps...

US fatwa against Julian Assange

[methodius.livejournal.com]

Yet, if you believe the US media, it is only Iran that issues fatwas declaring people outlaws -- but I see very little difference between this and whoever declared Salman Rushdie an outlaw.

Re: US fatwa against Julian Assange

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

Or between this and the Chinese way with dissidents.

[daisytells.livejournal.com]

Yes, we are now in an age of neo-fascism, born with Ronald Reagan and the Bushes. People are so brainwashed now that they think this is normal. God help us all!

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

And Obama- who promised to turn things round- is carrying on in Bush's footsteps.

[sovay]

By the way, what a terrible disappointment Obama has been.

Yes.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I remember exactly where I was on the day of his inauguration- and how happy I was.

[oakmouse]

Yes, the US is behaving terribly badly with regard to Assange. I am ashamed to say that only that opportunistic looney, Ron Paul, has been willing to publicly admit that we have no standing whatsoever to seek to try Assange.

And Obama, predictably, has done as Clinton did: bent over for big business (especially the insurance industry), thus proving himself to be a consummate machine politician.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

One of the things that was urged against him in the election was that we was inexperienced. Perhaps an older, tougher politician might have put up more of a fight.

[oakmouse]

Not if Slick Willie is anything to judge by. He was older, wilier, and tougher, plus had much more experience, and he did exactly the same thing.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

You're right, of course.

[setsuled.livejournal.com]

Some of those political loud-mouths who have been shouting for his head don't even seem to be aware that he's not actually an American citizen. No, a US court can't try an Australian citizen for treason.

I've witnessed this misconception firsthand more than once. It sits beside a lot of simultaneously sad and hilarious things I hear.

By the way, what a terrible disappointment Obama has been.

I was really pleased when he won the election, but at some level I kind of knew he'd turn out like this, particularly without a filibuster proof Democratic majority in the senate. It's why I preferred Hillary Clinton--her rhetoric and track record weren't as stridently liberal as Obama's, but she seemed more likely to actually get anything done.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I wanted Obama to win, but- with hindsight- I think Clinton would have been the better choice. I don't like her, but she's tough.

[creakiness.livejournal.com]

The other day at work I got an office wide email that said, since we receive government grants, we're forbidden to view any information on the Wikileaks case. This also extends to our off hours and home computers as well. It makes we wonder how this could be enforced.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

How very extraordinary.

Does that mean you're not allowed to read the NY Times?

[creakiness.livejournal.com]

I suppose so. It's hardly practical. The story is just about everywhere you go.

[wlotus.livejournal.com]

You mean to tell me he isn't even an American citizen, yet some folks here are accusing him of treason?

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Some people go to such lengths to protect dirty laundry that should be aired. If the government WE are paying for doesn't want its dirty laundry aired, it ought to CLEAN IT, duh!

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

And of course there are the others who have been saying he ought to be murdered....