O World Invisible, We View Thee

[poliphilo]

I haven't done any religion since I walked away from church. There's a baptism coming up. I said I'd go to that and take photos. Ailz is being godmother so I need to lend support.

As I just wrote in a comment on someone else's journal, I can't rest easy inside anyone else's system. Draw lines around me and the thing that interests me most will be the thing that lies outside them.

And yet, in a general sort of a way, my faith has never been so strong. Now that I no longer believe in God my belief in God is unshakeable.

Comments

[jackiejj.livejournal.com]

Tony, I kept thinking about you while I was reading the latest book by Bishop John Spong--here it is on Amazon UK.

It's his most thoughtful book, very honest. I'd be interested in what you think about it.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

It's difficult.

I spent a fair bit of my life doing what Spong is doing, trying to reconcile my continuing attachment to the church with beliefs that set me outside it. This year I walked away from organised religion for good- or, at least, I hope I did. That final, last ditch attempt to reach some sort of accomodation with it was making me ill.

I'm not looking forward to going to the baptism of our friend's child. In fact, the more I think about it, the more it gives me the heebie-jeebies.

[jackiejj.livejournal.com]

We had two baptisms yesterday morning.

Really, a baptism is just a way of saying the group will protect the child and teach it the group's beliefs, keep it from falling into heresy--it's drawing those lines around him.

But it's also setting him into a protected place where he can learn how to get along in the world, be a part of a community that accepts and guides him--he is like us and will continue to be like us and will someday bring his own children into the group.

The God part of it--well, no one needs this outward and visible sign, because imo the child is God already, filled up with God.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

At the moment the idea of attending any church service makes me edgy.

[sovay]

At the moment the idea of attending any church service makes me edgy.

Can you ask out of the baptism at this point? You take beautiful photographs, but would they be worth the stress?

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I don't know. It might be worth the stress. It's only an hour and a half out of my life. We'll see. :)

[sovay]

It's only an hour and a half out of my life. We'll see.

Best of luck either way, then!

[sunfell.livejournal.com]

I cannot abide organized religion. Any organized religion- even some of the more radical flavors of Pagandom. I had to promise my Teachers and Guides that I would only visit and observe -but never again join- any sort of religious group, and would teach independence and personal spiritual sovereignity to any students I chose to teach.

Divinity exists within all of us. That spark of the All is independent of any scripture, middlemen, priesthood, guru, spiritual interpreter, personal savior, or religion. That spark may be infinitesimal, but it is what connects me to that which is not comprehensible, and never will be. I cannot call it 'faith' because that still smacks too much of organized religion. For me, it is more of an awareness, a connection, a Gnosis. I don't believe, I know.

(the icon expresses my disdain for organized religion, not your post.)

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I'm at that place too. I "lapsed" earlier this year and attended our local church for three or four months. By the end of that time I was close to nervous breakdown- so I quit.

I'm not keen on the word "faith" either. I used it because I couldn't think of a better one.

Perhaps I need to think of a better one. What we have to say is inexpressible- but that doesn't mean we shouldn't try.

[sunfell.livejournal.com]

Trying is half the fun, wouldn't you agree?

I privately wondered how long you'd last with your religious 'relapse'. Should have started a betting pool! Glad you're better now. For me, it's gotten to where I cannot even stand to be at a public Pagan event when they're doing a Circle- and I'm anywhere near it. Don't even ask me to join it. The mental "Oh, no, you don't!" starts up if I even attempt to approach it- even accidentally.

:-)

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I think I need to write more about "spirituality". It will be a challenge doing so without leaning too heavily on an inherited- and degraded- vocabulary.

I haven't done anything in the Pagan community for years.

[daisytells.livejournal.com]

Religious ritual of any kind turns me off, but I do enjoy a good service-cum-sermon now and then. This year I dropped my church membership, but remain in spirit as I was before I left the church. Churchianity does not work for me. Neither did the Buddhist trip, the Pagan trip or the amalgamated New Age trip. All of these happened in my youth, and left me rudderless for many years.
I go to church occasionally, various churches, and also various observances of other faiths. I do not get ill from these visits. If I did I would stay away altogether as you do.
You are the first person I have ever met who suffered so at a place of worship...

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I have a complicated history with Christianity. I'm still, technically speaking, an Episcopalian priest and it would be very easy for me to step back into that role. If I go to church there are all sorts of forces tugging at me.