I Surprise Myself

[poliphilo]

Yesterday morning we were in Glastonbury.



Glastonbury is one of the two places I think of as "home".

I climbed the Tor as I always do. Dion Fortune says the air at the top is full of sparkles- and I can't think of a better way of putting it. On this occasion it made me feel very heavy and earthbound. I addressed myself to the genius locii and said, "Guidance would be nice".



I came back down and rejoined Ailz and Ruth in the town- and then I surprised myself. We went down a wynd- and there was a shop there called The Witchcraft Experience or something of the sort- and I insisted we went in- and first I bought a pendant in the shape of a viulva- which I wore for the rest of the day- and then an amber ring for Ailz and a pentacle ring for myself.



Will I wear this to church on Sunday?

But of course.

Because Jesus is not enough. He's the god of the public temple I can get to most easily- so convenience comes into it- but I have to say I've never really loved him. Tipharetic Sun Gods aren't particularly lovable. They're too bright and shiny. Did anyone ever love- as opposed to adore- Apollo?  I need other Gods in my life.

Especially I need Her.

They have a Temple of the Goddess in a yard in Glastonbury. You go up wooden steps into an upper room. You take off your shoes- as if it were a mosque- and leave them by the door. There was a woman at the back arranging flowers. The shrine is Hindu or Catholic in its over-the-topness, with incense and taped music and lots and lots of images. The central image is a terracotta statue of Herself as Crone in a cloaked hood carrying Her staff. I could look at images of Jesus all day and feel nothing in particular- except admiration for the artistry- but show me any image of Her....

I lit a couple of candles- and promised I'd rebuild our temple at home- in some form or other.

Comments

[seraphimsigrist.livejournal.com]

I believe the concept is that Jesus
was a particular person in the world--
that is to say more intimate to some
than to others and so on-- and that in
the fulness which he rises and ascends into
beyond his death he is now ,without loss of
the particular, also beyond particularity and
equally intimate to each person...and beyond
also the simple particularity of male or
female and so on.

I am not sure that dion fortune ever understood
this about Jesus Christ (or one should say about
the Christian teaching concerning Christ). I expect a
good many priests of quite regular belief have never
thought or felt it through either...

Is Geoffrey Ashe still alive? He lived in her house
at the foot of the tor. when I visited I had gin and
lime with him. he was Catholic and daily at mass.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I understand that way of thinking about Jesus. God is beyond images, I think. What we need to do- if we have the luxury of choosing- is to settle on those which engage us most.

Dion Fortune phased in and out of Christianity- rather as I am doing, I suppose. I don't know her writings well enough to know what she thought and felt about the person of the Christ. I admire her for her book on the Cabala. Otherwise, I find her rather a gushy person.

Is Wikipedia is to be trusted, Ashe is still alive. I have a couple of his books on my shelves.

classic. and on to the moon. visit

[mitcher.livejournal.com]

her psychic self defence is a classic
and especially the account of the attack
in the night by a psychic wolf sent by
(she suspected was it mathers or crowley)
which leaped on her.
here budge's dog of defence spell would come
in useful I suspect, or here if anywhere that is...

yes gushy...
as to christ the concept of solar logos means also
that he is the logos for here and someone else can
be for there and so on...it is a rather crude way
of dealing with the universality of the 'godmanhood'
as noted above...
and in general her ,and others', use of cabala seems
to have effect of distancing one from relation to
an personally engaged God.

have you read the delightful green man of kingsly amis
with the monty python style vicar dragged into doing
an exorcism and moaning about a personally engaged deity
having gone out long ago surely etc...

but I do think that if anything is the starting point
God, beyond all the gates and yet responsive to the human
cry, and then as you say the images...and where it all comes
together is for us to find in our way

"a clouded moon is most beautiful" as we say in the trade

excuse the pastoral visit but it is my metier
yrs
+Seraphim

tha t is me seraphim speaking!

[mitcher.livejournal.com]

it seems that misha cherniak
mitcher is logged in here and so
I am startled to see his face in the
userpic but it is me seraphim
answering on a strange computer.
cheers
+Seraphim

In his own write --classic,and on to the moon

[seraphimsigrist.livejournal.com]

relogged in so that if you should
reply to this it will go to me not to
Misha. but now drat! I cant delete the
other let me see if his logs in
automatically
her psychic self defence is a classic
and especially the account of the attack
in the night by a psychic wolf sent by
(she suspected was it mathers or crowley)
which leaped on her.
here budge's dog of defence spell would come
in useful I suspect, or here if anywhere that is...

yes gushy...
as to christ the concept of solar logos means also
that he is the logos for here and someone else can
be for there and so on...it is a rather crude way
of dealing with the universality of the 'godmanhood'
as noted above...
and in general her ,and others', use of cabala seems
to have effect of distancing one from relation to
an personally engaged God.

have you read the delightful green man of kingsly amis
with the monty python style vicar dragged into doing
an exorcism and moaning about a personally engaged deity
having gone out long ago surely etc...

but I do think that if anything is the starting point
God, beyond all the gates and yet responsive to the human
cry, and then as you say the images...and where it all comes
together is for us to find in our way

"a clouded moon is most beautiful" as we say in the trade

excuse the pastoral visit but it is my metier
yrs
+Seraphim

[algabal.livejournal.com]

The second picture is too beautiful.

I have to disagree that Jesus isn't enough (at least in an emotional sense), although admittedly I'm also pretty fond of Orpheus, Kapila, Paul, Marcion and Mani.

[arielstarshadow.livejournal.com]

I'm afraid I really can't express myself well at all these days, but I did want to say that you can't know how much I appreciate you continuing to post about your journey through faith and religion.

[ex-redrain.livejournal.com]

I swear I live in the wrong country after seeing all your pictures...

[veronica-milvus.livejournal.com]

There's you getting back to "normal"! yay!

I personally can't get beyond "god" as a life force or bundle of natural law or Grand Unified Theory of Everything about how the Universe runs, and how that force might polarise itself in people's minds into matter and anti-matter, yin and yang, male and female... whatever. An inanimate thing, not much use praying to it.

But why the god bit should be fulfilled by the person of Jesus I am not sure - some guy in an obscure corner of the Roman empire 2000 years ago - just an accident of history. He did say some pretty cool things though, the Sermon on the Mount is a belter.

I was reading a quotation from Ghandi (was it Seraphim who posted it?) who said he didn't much like Christians, they were so unlike their Christ. That's why I could not get involved with the established Church of our country, or any other, in fact.

We had to go to mass the other night (praying for the soul of my departed mother in law) and the priest asked for donations to some good cause or other. To which my husband and his brothers riposte was - sell some of the antique stuff in the Vatican first, then we'll consider it.

[veronica-milvus.livejournal.com]

England really is beautiful - even in the winter.

[arielstarshadow.livejournal.com]

I got the impression that he meant that in a personal sense, not in a general sense. :) As in "not enough for me" as opposed to a blanket statement.

Re: In his own write --classic,and on to the moon

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

It was Mrs Mathers, wasn't it?

I've always liked Fortune's suggestion that the best way to protect yourself against psychic attack was to go watch a Charlie Chaplin movie.

I'm a little confused at the moment. There I was, trundling round, looking at the sights- and suddenly I find myself having a religious crisis. Nevermind, it will all sort itself out in the end.

I'm always delighted to receive a pastoral visit from yourself :)

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I'm fond of Orpheus too. And Paul. Paul gets a bad press (getting blamed for everything that's "wrong" with Christianity) but I think he was a genius.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

Thankyou.

It's rather a dizzying ride at the moment. I thought I knew where I was headed and then, suddenly, the road forked

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I love this landscape- and the human things that are dotted around in it.

[easyalchemy.livejournal.com]

I always think about Jesus as more of a Dionysius figure - I know D and Apollo are two sides of the same coin, but I find his boundary-crossing/dissolving aspects to be more at the heart of his teachings than his sun-godishness.

I've been thinking about returning to the church, too, though I was never really whole-heartedly involved, even as a young choir member. I really was there for the music.
There's a local United Church with a strong interest in social activism and awareness, which also happens to be the closest church to my house, which all seems very convenient. I'm wondering if I'm missing something, as an adult - not something I had as a kid, because rural Ontario UC is mostly about 'lasagna and disapproval,' as my friend David says. But some kind of community spirit, that's missing from the rest of life. We'll see.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I need to find a place to Christianity in my scheme of things. I don't- as yet- know where.

I just assembled a little Goddess shrine for myself in the back bedroom. It includes an image of St Catherine from the church at Deerhurst, just south of Tewkesbury. It occured to me after I'd selected it that St. Catherine with her wheel is in fact a Christianized form of Fortuna or Nemesis- one of my very favourite Goddesses.

I love the Sermon on the Mount. It's the genius of Christianity- and Judaism before it- that it harnessed religion to morality. Much as I love the old Gods they were none of them particularly moral.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

If I carry on going to Church- as I well may- it's because I value belonging to a spiritual community.

But it's going to be tricky. Can I be a Christian and Not-a-Christian at the same time? I suppose the only way to find out is to try living it.

Re: In his own write --classic,and on to the moon

[oakmouse]

There I was, trundling round, looking at the sights- and suddenly I find myself having a religious crisis.

Glastonbury is that kind of place. It...how do I say this...breaks apart things that have cracks in them.

[oakmouse]

Gorgeous pictures. Glastonbury is a very special place.

[oakmouse]

Didn't the Bible say "Thou shalt have no other gods before me?" Seems to me that doesn't mean the same thing at all as "Thou shalt have no other gods" --- more like "I want to be on an equal footing with the rest". If you can manage that, then it might well work.

[sovay]

But of course.

I hope you will not be offended if I say good.

I lit a couple of candles- and promised I'd rebuild our temple at home- in some form or other.

You could paint it.

[daisytells.livejournal.com]

Correct me if I am wrong. Isn't Glastonbury a formerly pagan site that was "baptized" by an order of Christian monks, then returned to its former state in modern times? If not, do you know the true history, and would you be willing to enlighten me?
I think you know from some of my previous posts that I recognize "magical" places, and like you, I experience very emotional moments in some of these places. I can feel the spirits surrounding the areas of which I speak.
By the way, as always, these are wonderful pictures. What kind of camera do you use? I am planning to buy a new one that will do more than the present one, and I am asking this question of many friends whose pictures I admire.

[daisytells.livejournal.com]

There is room in every sect, cult or world religion for "seekers", isnt there? There was a sign on the door of my very fundamentalist Christian church in Salem, Massachusetts that stated "All Welcome" - and they realy meant it, too.

[daisytells.livejournal.com]

"Two roads diverged in a wood and I,
I took the one less traveled by
And that has made all the difference"
(Robert Frost, "The Road Less Traveled")

Re: In his own write --classic,and on to the moon

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

If it was a realistic proposition- if I didn't have promises to keep- I would live there.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I think something like that is what I'm being asked to do.

A balancing act.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

That's nice.

Though it sort of implies that the church has the answers- and what I will be saying to them (ever so gently and maybe not out loud)- is, "Oh no, you don't"

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

It feels more like home to me than most places do.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I think it's good too.

I could, couldn't I!

[seraphimsigrist.livejournal.com]

I think dion fortune for all her gushing
was a sounder person that dolores ascroft-
nowicki (sol if you are familiar, but I am
out of date and not sure what the structures
are now)
well but more generally
Tony, remember with spiritual stuff you know
God and the world and so on dont depend as much
on us as we do on them , God creates us and
is not rendered short of breath when our faith
wavers or goes off a bit somewhere...
but to know all of life that is appropriate
for us...
so God be with you in all your comings and
goings and sometimes speak to God also as person
to person and ...
thats all I have now,
+Seraphim

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

The camera is a Nikon Coolpix- nothing very special. I like how handy it is- that I can wear it at my belt.

Actually I have two cameras. The other is a Kodak EasyShare. I think the Kodak has a better flash.

Glastonbury's "true history" is uncertain. It may have been a prehistoric holy island- but there's nothing in the archaeology to bear this out. There are many myths and legends- but most of them are of modern origin.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

I suppose I've read a couple of things by Ashcroft-Nowicki- and- no- I don't rate her as highly as Dion Fortune.

I very much like that phrase about God not being rendered short of breath by our waverings. I'm suddenly reminded of Shelley's lines-

"Life like a dome of many-coloured glass
Stains the white radiance of eternity"

We all have our favourite colours- or combination of colours- but the white radiance is the Thing.

[seraphimsigrist.livejournal.com]

yes the hesrt of light
the fire that does not burn or singe
a sleeve etc
the second light of
"with thee is the fountain of life
and in thy light we shall see Light"
and yet I would hold that white radiance
is of the same spectrum as that reflected
in a pool of rain water etc
all is light of light as it may be
or something or , dash it man, time for
me to turn in for the night
+S

[nostoi.livejournal.com]

After reading this post earlier, I was daydreaming whilst doing the washing up about a point sometime in the future where people will require a religion that encompasses both the male and the female (above and beyond the virgin Mary cult in Catholicism), and that in another 2000 years perhaps there will be a bizarre (to us) amalgamation of the Goddess-cult and the God-cult to form a new, more balanced (gender-wise at least) religion.

[daisytells.livejournal.com]

I, too, have a Kodak Easy Share. However, I have a more powerful - and more compact camera that is put out by HP. What I am looking for is a camera that will let me get clear closeups without me standing right on top of the subjects - so that when I go to the zoo I can get good shots of the animals in their habitats, for example.

[daisytells.livejournal.com]

I am not a complete yes-person in any church, but I would only join a church whose first premise I accept. There is something in me that balks at too many rules.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

Me too. Which is why I couldn't ever become a Catholic and why the relatively lackadaisical Anglican church suits me.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

What you want is a powerful telephoto lens- or more precisely a camera body to which you can attach such a lens.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

That would be good, wouldn't it!

That was the main reason I was attracted to Wicca- because it's an equal-opportunity religion.

[daisytells.livejournal.com]

And that is why I left the Catholic Church at the age of 13 to explore the many sects of Protestantism, then diverge to Eastern religions, to paganism, to no faith at all, and finally -- home again to christianity - but not RC.

[poliphilo.livejournal.com]

At least these days we have the choice. Go back two hundred years- or less- and you accepted the brand of religion that was on offer locally- or else!