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[personal profile] poliphilo
The detective story exists in a parallel universe- one in which unlikely people commit unlikely crimes for unlikely reasons. It's fantasy, but tightly constricted fantasy. In the interests of playing fair with the reader everything has to proceed according to the rules of a Newtonian universe- no monkeying around with space-time,  no science fiction, nothing supernatural.

In other words the detective story tells lies about human nature but is not allowed to lie freely or fantastically. It's neither realism nor magic realism but something in between. 

The writer of detective fiction willingly dons a straitjacket.

It's no wonder, then,  that there are so few good detective stories that are also great literature.

Bleak House is a detective story but it's not a good detective story. The problem is too elementary.

The Sherlock Holmes stories are great literature by accident. Doyle thought he was writing cheap magazine stories and stumbled into a whole new world. He is a great original. He created the genre and more or less exhausted it. Most later detectives and their sidekicks are shadows of Holmes and Watson.

G.K. Chesterton pushed the detective story as far in the direction of fantasy as it will go. A handful of the Father Brown stories are brilliant fables, brilliantly written. Most of them are just too wild

A number of the writers of the Golden Age attempted to write detective stories that were also serious literature.  Margery Allingham, anyone? 

The more literary Dorothy L. Sayers attempted to be, the more unreadable she became.

Agatha Christie is the best. The Murder of Roger Ackroyd is perfect of its kind. It's like the Rubick cube- wonderfully simple, wonderfully cunning. There's no way you could improve on it. A masterpiece, but not a literary masterpiece.  

Ruth Rendell sensibly divides herself in two. Rendell for detection, Vine for literature.

I can think of only one great novel that's also a great detective story. The Name of the Rose. Not even its creator has been able to duplicate its success.

Date: 2007-10-06 03:59 pm (UTC)
sovay: (Default)
From: [personal profile] sovay
The more literary Dorothy L. Sayers attempted to be, the more unreadable she became.

I love the last quartet with Harriet Vane, but I have noticed that I read them more for character than for mystery.

Date: 2007-10-06 04:20 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] poliphilo.livejournal.com
I never cared that much for Lord Peter. I found his silly ass act annoying. I could tolerate him as a detective, but I really couldn't take an interest in his love life.


Date: 2007-10-06 04:51 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] bodhibird.livejournal.com
I suspect Lord Peter appeals far more to women, and women of a certain type, at that, than to men. *g* But as much as I love Sayers, her habit of writing long stretches of dialogue with no attributions and no definite action on the part of the characters drives me batty.

Date: 2007-10-06 08:14 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] poliphilo.livejournal.com
I think you're right. I've noticed Lord Peter has a lot of fans on LJ- and they're all women.

Date: 2007-10-07 04:03 am (UTC)
sovay: (Lord Peter Wimsey)
From: [personal profile] sovay
I could tolerate him as a detective, but I really couldn't take an interest in his love life.

It's not his love life I'm interested in, but what it illuminates about both characters. For me, Wimsey becomes infinitely more of a person and less a collection of mannerisms in the last four books; and though I don't know if it's true, I've been told that Sayers originally created Harriet for the purposes of marrying him off and making him disappear, and was then forced to write her three-dimensionally, because she couldn't believe her hero falling for someone made of cardboard. (So it should be true, because it's a great parable about unexpected character evolution.) The genre I really avoid is romance. Nonetheless, I return to these books: I should analyze why.

Date: 2007-10-07 09:37 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] poliphilo.livejournal.com
That's interesting. It's always interesting when characters take on a life of their own and won't obey their creator.

I may have approached Gaudy Night from the wrong angle. I was expecting a great detective story and Sayers didn't deliver. This may have blinded me to what she was really doing.

Date: 2007-10-06 04:50 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] bodhibird.livejournal.com
*raises a hand to second your vote*

I don't really like mysteries, but I like the Wimsey novels. American writer Jane Langton is another exception, but I read her for style, character, the color of her settings (always well researched and richly portrayed) rather than to solve the crime.

Date: 2007-10-06 08:06 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] poliphilo.livejournal.com
Langton is new to me. I must look her up.

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